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Conversation with Biggars

December 6, 2012 in South Africa, uncategorized

Equalspaces December 1 Conversation with Biggars

Biggars posted the whole piece and I divided it up for responses. I had neither discussed rape with the women of UPA or with him.

I did post on Yvette Abrahams and the work of other writers -white males and females- as information resources without offering any opinion on these works. He made no comment on those posts but some time later, after I made it clear that I would post on civil society voice, citizen activism and gender, that whatever government is in power, that such a government must be held accountable by an informed and critical electorate and citizenry, this and other posts and comments started.

After this Biggars disassociated from my page but posted to me or at me in his group. Did he want to battle me in a space of his choosing and where he had hoped to get more support?

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Matthew Biggars: This has been discuss at another place by Coloured People, are all Coloured People a product of rapist was the question, does a unmarried women give her child the surname of the rapist was the question, is it speculative history that the all Coloured People are a result of Colonist raping Khoi Women was the question, …”

Reply: I am not aware that I deba ted this issue. Please copy me the my debate elsewhere on this.

Matthew Biggars: I’m a descendant of a Aboriginal Women and she married that why my Surname comes from another continent. men?

Reply: I think that all women did not marry their masters, lovers, owners or rapists. Does marriage to the father make a child legitimate? Is a child unholy, from the devil, evil and undeserving and thus should not get the father’s name if the mother is not married to the father?

Matthew Biggars: Why were you banned from UPA group, is it because Coloured Women on that page EXCO did not agree with you and now you seem to have a problem with all

Reply: I shall then post all the banning posts and comments. After all you were there and part of the discussions. Why do YOU ask the question now?

Matthew Biggars: If you want to say that I’m a product of rapist, then are you a product of rapist or did your grandmother marry for love or take the surname of a rapist, if it is for love, then the issue is over.

Reply: When did I say that YOU are a product of a rapist? Do you have a problem because I post on or links to research on the Khoisan and Khoekhoe and South African history? It is an issue that I post on articles and books by both white and coloured researchers? Other people should not know about these works and opinions? Have you tried to understand Yvette Abrahams’ view and research? Is she a hater too because she researches and writes on Khoisan /Khoekhoe history especially on women? People should not know about her work? People should not know about the Saartjie Baartman discscussions and debates?

Matthew Biggars: …or did your grandmother marry for love or take the surname of a rapist, if it is for love, then the issue is over.

Reply: My grandmother married for love hey … but my slave ancestor- now that would be a different story hey…

Matthew Biggars: Please if you hate people because they are White, then state that and so that all people know that is your personal view,

Reply: This must be one of the cheapest comments that YOU could make. Of course you are not personal and not personally investigating and interrogating me because that would make me important as you said. You are just talking in the wind… trying to undermine me and to give me a bad reputation. Just because you are such an honourable Christian man and a leader trying to build an exclusive coloured vote for an exclusive coloured party. And so now if one posts on a wide source of recorded and published research, books and opinions, then it means that one hates? This is exactly why I asked you to comment on the relevant post. Then there would be context and things could not be so easily twisted and confused.

Matthew Biggars: I’m proud of my White & Aboriginal ancestry and so are maybe 99% of people still Classified Coloured by the current ANC & DA government.

Reply: I believe that I have made similar admissions about my ancestry. Perhaps you could find those and quote them- if your selective eye allows you to:) Recall a discussion somewhere where I raised that we have hailed our European ancestry and need to also recognize our indigenous forefathers and mothers? I think that I am one of the few that posted on this personal history online.

Matthew Biggars: The Government is made up jointly of political parties, all those taking part in government have failed to get rid of the Apartheid Racial Classification of people of mixed ancestry 18 years into Democracy, now having a Coloured Political Party to fix this issue seems more logical then taking another route, namely war, but then you seem to think a political solution to the problem is not the correct way and that the world does not have enough wars.

Reply: Hmmm … So entrench the classification? This will not lead to war? A strong ‘racial’ group of marginalized people will not start demanding land and other rights and their ancient entitlements and rise in opposition when their parliamentary presence do not have the desired effect? Every time I ask what REVOLUTION means in these discussions, banning hovers in the air. Will the REVOLUTION include dealing with coloureds that do not vote for the one coloured party? How?

Matthew Biggars GOD our CREATOR please teach us YOUR way of love and that YOU control everything, please help Ms. Hess to learn to forgive as she seems to believe in Jesus but she forgets the words: “forgive us as we forgive others”

Reply: My cheeks have been beaten fleshless- where would you like to strike next? I’ll collate and post the UCF banning stuff and then you could perhaps get Gordon to help you beat me up again. Like · · Share

RESPONSES

Richard Kutela U 2 are bretheren.Stop fighting. December 1 at 11:32am via mobile · Like · 1

Equalspaces What can a woman do when men decide to beat her up Richard Kutela? A woman never knows what such man will decide is the next reason and justification to beat her up. Sjoe, and when that man has God on his side, what is a woman to do? December 1 at 7:50pm · Like

Matthew Biggars Dear Madam Hess, please check your data for a copy of the issue as I will not copy it, my interest in this issue is over, as I stated my interest was because I’m proud of my White and Aboriginal Ancestry, you have not convicned me that any of my KhoiSan grandmothers was raped nor that any of my White grandfathers were rapist. Whatever your seculative history is, it does not apply to my family. Your opinions on the matter are your opinions and you are respected for your opinions. Madam evidence is a distroyer of any good rape theory. I’m not deciding for you, but I will defend the women in my family, they have defended me and are stronger than me, they are no victims. December 1 at 10:15pm · Like

Equalspaces  Matthew Biggars: I have at no time discussed whether the women in your family were rape victims. I do not think that I have discussed rape with you. December 1 at 11:07pm · Edited · Like

Equalspaces As far as I am concerned, I did not directly engage on your post regarding Khoisan women and rape. December 1 at 10:26pm · Like

Equalspaces I have however, as I have done for decades, posted on social issues, women and people that explore these topics and write about them during the South African Women’s Month, the International Women’s Month and during the 16 Days of Activism and the run-up periods to these activism months. December 1 at 10:27pm · Like

Equalspaces You are of course most welcome Matthew Biggars, to confront Yvette Abrahms on her views on Khoisan women and their coloniial experiences, as recorded in her books. In fact, it would be the proper thing to do. December 1 at 10:30pm · Like

Equalspaces At this time I have not posted an expressed personal view but intend to post views from more researchers on the matter and on the prevalent social conditions and slave /servant – owner /boss colonial relationships. I suggest that you do not take any of it personally but view the material as information resources. December 1 at 10:34pm · Like

Matthew Biggars her book does not mean anything to me, again that is her book, I will not waste my money. December 1 at 10:39pm · Like

Equalspaces That is as it is Matthew Biggars. Last year and early this year I posted on women related to the Great March and also a bit on Baartman. I believe that I have never attacked your research on elections nor your application of the information, nor that you post the information. It what we do on these pages hey, share information. You are asking people to act in a certain way on the basis of the information that you post. In this regard, I am merely saying that this information and these resources exist. It is not reason to fight with me, and off post at that. As a man you might tell me the saying: Play the ball, not the man. Please deal with the post information on the actual post responding to it on comments there. It would really help a lot:)

8 responses to Conversation with Biggars

  1. If this is a fight you are in on another platform, why bring it all up here ?

  2. Because czardas, when people set themselves up us leaders for political parties and the activities outcomes will ultimately affect all our lives, we should all know about it.
    For one, the collective /consolidated coloured vote is not merely to oppose the ANC or the DA, but to strengthen the position for the implementation of UNDRIP.
    If women are not to have a meaningful voice, then this too will short circuit societal upliftment, whether for all of us or for the coloured people.
    It connects with my other sites.

  3. Do we have censorship now?
    Never one day say that I have not shared, or only posted about white people’s nastiness.
    Does it only interest you when I post about white nastiness? Is coloured foolishness and nastiness inconsequential if I post it but if this was about white person then it would have been a horse of another colour…?

  4. You do remember your comments on the Smella blog czardas? You should be the first now to say that I am not biased- not with regards to less tasteful situations that I find myself in, or questionable non-white attitudes and discourses.
    You are welcome here.
    Let us just keep our minds open.
    If these power and land issues go to UNDRIP, there is a good chance that the Western Cape and a few other regions will fall to the Aboriginal Peoples.
    … and THAT will just be the beginning…

  5. I don’t have a clue what all of you are on about, but this Matthew fellow appears to use rather odd arguments…

  6. Hi g-whizz:) I have been a bit out of it having hurt my back and being away from home all of last week and the long weekend.

    At a point, quite soon, I will explain more about this.

    I am a little surprised at some of the Biggar arguments myself… Expected a bit more you know…:)

    But people are people hey- all sorts everywhere- and sometimes we get real gems from all and any quarters, and we keep looking for the gems:)

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